German Car Zone

Originally Posted by Imhotep Evil

I have to agree with a lot of what you said, but...

BMW while making entry level Isettas/600s and 700s have also made elite expensive cars. And that was actually the problem, some BMWs were even more expensive that MBs.

And since these cars couldn't win races (unlike pre war models, witch meant no publicity), and europeans couldn't afford them, and were also too pricey, they failed (in the eyes of the american public).

Also you have to keep in mind that MB also made some entry level cars like the 170V and 170D, and unlike BMW they had a higly profitable commercial vehicle division.

Now contrary to popular american beliefs that BMWs greatness started with cars such as the 2002, "New Sixes" and later 70s cars (3er, 5er, 6er, 7er) it's simply not true, in Europe at least.

In the 60s BMWs research came up with some interesting results. People would still remeber BMW for its cars of the 1930s (328, 327, 326 and even 335).
So Paul G. Hahnemann and Bernt Spiegel came up with a niche teory witch would safeguard BMW future.
BMW could equall and perhaps surpass their glory days of the late 1930s if they would create cars diferent in some ways from MB and similar in some ways to the cars of the 1930 for witch BMW was best known. And the 328 and 327/28 were known (especially the 328) for handling. Eventually with the influence of Max Hoffman this would lead to the 2002 and "New Sixes".

And the rest is history.

Originally Posted by donau

Very true about the BMWs of the 1930's. Fantastic cars. Of course I have only read about them and seen pictures of them. I think the people who remember them are getting quite old by now and therefore their ranks have been thinning as well unfortunately since I'm sure we all have some near and dear who we would rather still have with us. But anyhow, you are right about the very early BMWs. And of course Audi also had a glorious past especially with Horch, Audi and Wanderer. DKWs were always definitely at the affordable end.
With my comment above, I was mainly thinking of the people in their 50s, 60s and 70s for whom MB has always been amongst the very best. Even the people in their 70s, particularly in Europe don't really remember the 30s BMWs because of the war years. Their youth was spent "otherwise occupied" as children dodging bombers, being concerned about getting food etc. Even though I was born 8 years after the end of WW2 (in Finland), by far the single most talked about thing for most of my childhood was the war. It shadowed everything else.
While the MB 170 was definitely an affordable entry level MB, it was still in a totally different class from the BMWs and the DKWs. As I've mentioned many times before, I remember the MB 170 very well. Even the 170 models were amongst the very best at the time because they were Mercedes cars.

Originally Posted by Imhotep Evil

Well, that's just it, as I said it, when BMW conducted their research in the 1960s, people even than sort of forgot the failures (like the 501, 502, 503, 507, 3200 CS) of BMW, witch now becomed pricey colectibles. However you are to belive that these cars were anything but common, and would somehow be embarassed by MBs of their time. It's just that they failed in the market and were thus not remembered/imprinted in people's heads, and BMW did not had the status of MB. This was BMW's own fault too partialy.

Ofcourse, in Finland, doubtfully that people remembered the glorious BMW of the 1930s.

BTW I've put some pictures in the previous page. Take a look.

Originally Posted by donau

But I miss so many of those cars: Packards, Studebakers etc. etc.

Originally Posted by Imhotep Evil

Add Duesenberg, Peerless, Pierce-Arrows, Cord, some Simcas, Delahaye, Talbot Lago, and so on and so on.
Some people said that had the 507 been BMWs last car, it would have been a beautifull way to die. But instead cars such as the Isetta/600 and 700 kept BMW going and than relaunched it, along wit the 1500.

Originally Posted by BMW_Dude

I'd agree, in the UK all BMW drivers are thought of as jerks who cut people out and generally drive badly! It doesn't stop the sales though!

Originally Posted by klier

In Holland all MB drivers are thought to be fat construction workers with a fake gold Rolex... It doesn't stop the sales though!

Originally Posted by The Artist

LOL there are like million of those stereo type car drivers around the world..
for example..BMW drivers are often seen as Homo Thugs here in gothenburg