German Car Zone

or buy from the competition who already has them.

How the hell did this turn into a BMW vs MB thread again? What the F89K has this got to do with BMW's supposed direction?

Everyone here knows that, for an entire engine line up, BMW is the best manufacturer in the world. Other car makers may have isolated examples of brilliance but that's where it ends. So let's not go down this road. Not here.

Let me remind you that this is a valuable discussion around the merits of BMW's pursuit of crossover models - case in point 3er GT - versus a (perceived) lack of interest in building more focused, less mainstream appealing performance derivatives.

People please, let's focus on quality and not one-liner MB is better than BMW codswollop.

Party pooper!

Hehe, but yea you are right. So going back to the GT, I saw this thing today and I realized where BMW got the whole GT thing from and no, they did not copy the R class, they got the it from...

























The Hyndia Elantra GT (yes, you read it right, it is called the GT!). Haha, when I saw it, I actually couldn't help laughing thinking about how much ammunition I am going to give the MB circle jerk squad here. So here is some more.. and you guys owe me big time.

Thanks, Martin.

Every single post from now on that is not related to the subject of the thread will be deleted with no excuse.

Good lord, that hideous ( ) post of Sunny's just reminded me of how much I hate fastbacks. Does the world really need a BMW fastback? BMW will have us thinking otherwise and that we're not progressive enough and looking at the car market through rose-tinted glasses.

But there's no denying it: fastbacks are fugly. The only manufacturer that I can remember getting the fastback to look cool was Saab. Just look at the new Lancer Sportback. ugh! So yeah, I'm dead against them.

Well Elantra is hardly the first modern fastback/hatchback. But the implementation is only slightly poorer than its almost as ugly sedan sister.
There are good fastbacks - IMO the former Mazda 6 Sport is a good example. You can also consider the Jag XK to be a fastback.
Also, I'm betting the upcoming A5 Sportback will look better than the A4 sedan. But none of them have this "cutoff" ass of Elantra or "big momma" ass of 5GT

The SAAB 9000 is another fine example of this utterly pointless configuration.

Why is it pointless? It's more useful than a sedan. It also needn't be uglier. It depends on the implementation.

If you really want to analyze, then the sedan is the most pointless of car shapes. It's not as rigid or sporty as a coupe. It's practically the same as a wagon, except has less utility and storage space. It doesn't provide the benefit of raised suspension or off-road ability. And yet it is the most popular car variant. Perhaps it is because it provided the best compromise between looks and utility (halfway between wagon and coupe). If there is a fastback that manages this compromise better than a sedan (to look good, yet provide the added benefit of a liftgate) then why the hell not? One of the reasons I like Jag XK is because of its boot. I don't see how it would be any better looking with a conventional boot, yet it is more practical than some coupes the way it is.

Actually no. The sedan and a coupe is designed for two completely different reason, so it is grossly inaccurate to make such a generalised comment and say the sedan is pointless because it isn't as sporty as the coupe. They aren't suppose to be in the 1st place. As for the rigidity of the car's structure, it is down to the design, material and the methods of construction. Some people never need the utility and the storage space of a wagon, so for them the sedan is more than sufficient. Plus wagons are less refined than their sedan version.

Yes I will agree with that. I had a Saab 9000cs and it was the most practical car we have ever had.

Not really, I had one of these and it is very practical. Like all hatchbacks you can remove the rear parcel shelf which reduce the height restrictions of the cargo you can carry, so it can fit a TV or a washing machine with no problems at all.